Parenting is hard. I speak from firsthand experience as I have two kids of my own. When you add sports into the equation, parenting can get even more stressful. As elite performers, parents must have their own strategies for maintaining calm, focused confidence to best serve their young athletes.\
My guest, Rachel Duffy, is a Certified Conscious Parenting Coach. With over two decades of combined experience as a family lawyer and parenting coach, Rachel has spent her entire adult life in the trenches with families.
Rachel helps families create lasting change by helping them to identify and address the root causes of family relationship issues.
In Episode 51, Rachel shares her thoughts on how to build stronger connections with our children to withstand the emotional roller coaster that is youth sports.
So, what’s your biggest takeaway from my conversation with Rachel Duffy?
My biggest takeaway is that connecting with our children unconditionally can be really difficult. Kids can perceive parents’ sports participation as a form of conditional love and it’s our job as parents to alleviate that as much as possible.
My suggestion to parents is to explore why we feel the way we do about our kids’ sports experiences. Often, our discomfort is not about them, it’s about us.
I want to thank Rachel for her kind generosity and the wisdom she shared with The Freshman Foundation Community.
You can check out Rachel’s Unscrew You Podcast at https://unscrewyoupodcast.com and on Instagram @rachelduffyhere.
To learn HOW mental performance coaching can help your mind work FOR you rather than AGAINST you, visit https://michaelvhuber.com.
Thank you for listening. We’ll see you back soon for Episode 52!
00:00.00
mvhuber
Hi Rachel how are you.
00:01.38
Rachel Duffy
Hey Michael so happy to be here with you. Thanks for inviting me.
00:06.40
mvhuber
Yeah, it's ah we're recording on Halloween. So if you're listening ah we are celebrating Halloween on the freshman foundation podcast we're both in costume. no no no I'm just kidding just kidding just kidding. Um, so I guess the first question Rachel I'll ask you? um. You know you're you're a parenting coach. So when you have parents who have teenage children sort of what are some of the the most common challenges you see ah in us in those situations.
00:32.82
Rachel Duffy
Yeah I think the teenage years are challenging because a lot of things are happening at the same time and as parents we often find ourselves a bit torn on 1 hand parents see their children struggle. Whether it's struggling with changes in in their bodies struggling with hormones which we've all been through struggling socially, there's this kind of ah our children themselves are getting torn between you know, hanging out with their parents versus.
00:55.17
mvhuber
Ah.
01:08.88
Rachel Duffy
Wanting to be with their friends more It's kind of a natural stage of development and as parents a it's it's downright difficult and painful to watch your child struggle and not be able to do much about it. So that's 1 challenge parents come to me for is how do I deal with this. Then throw on top of that. How do I help my child navigate situations that we didn't have when we grew up because guess what it's such a different world now than when we were kids we didn't have internet. We didn't have online anything. There was no. Social media the challenges they face are really different from the ones we did when we grew up so it's actually it's not that easy. We don't always know the answer. what what do I tell them to do what do I tell them about online bullying. How do I help them? um connect. I just had a parent come to me literally this week where her school has adopted a kind of diversity and diversity equity and inclusion curriculum which is great and her son who's you know, 14 she's telling me he can't connect. With any of the material they're learning because he doesn't even know how to relate to any of the content which is kind of the opposite of what.
02:25.75
mvhuber
A.
02:37.30
Rachel Duffy
Many minorities have faced over the years but you know as a parent. She's like I don't know what to do with that I don't know how to help it I don't know how to connect with him and he's getting very angry and withdrawn and then sometimes I don't want to help him because he's not nice.
02:44.50
mvhuber
Ah.
02:53.54
mvhuber
Yeah, yeah.
02:57.15
Rachel Duffy
You know so there it really is a huge challenge I think and an opportunity for us as parents to lean into that and really understand our children understand them beyond their behaviors which are not always pleasant.
03:10.73
mvhuber
Um.
03:15.63
Rachel Duffy
And not always you know the way we would like to see them not at their best potential or fullest potential. Whatever that is and it's an opportunity for us as parents to learn how to connect without an agenda.
03:22.77
mvhuber
A.
03:33.72
Rachel Duffy
How to connect to another person who's not always wanting to connect with you but me.
03:39.39
mvhuber
Yeah I love that I mean I as a parent of a 14 and a twelve year old um I can completely relate to that and they are all the things you said sort of hit for me, you know the the physical changes the hormones the body changes right? Like just. Just the the independence all of it and you know it is really hard. You know to sort of see them transition into what is starting to be adults and it's difficult and I and I and I think too the the last part that you said about understanding.
03:57.10
Rachel Duffy
Right.
04:13.19
mvhuber
You know the 1 thing I couldn't help but think while you were talking about it was like what are the what are some of the feelings that come with that for the parents like what how do those things make them feel because that's really I think is the source of the discomfort is that all these things that we don't know how to handle or are very.
04:27.14
Rachel Duffy
Or.
04:32.30
mvhuber
Strange to us or new or make us feel a certain way and we're reacting to those feelings.
04:35.88
Rachel Duffy
I love that you brought that up. So first of all most of us don't know how to feel because we weren't either. We weren't allowed to feel too much when we were growing up or at all or we were told to shut down our feelings. So.
04:46.66
mvhuber
A.
04:55.66
Rachel Duffy
Anytime Big feelings come Up. We don't know what to do with it and add to that during this I think as we watch our children kind of start developing their own their opinions. Their style. They're experimenting with things sometimes they're experimenting not in you know, not necessarily super Risky behavior but just the way they're expressing themselves doesn't sit well with us right? and.
05:23.29
mvhuber
Um, yeah.
05:25.41
Rachel Duffy
We have to navigate that sense of oh I don't have a little kid anymore who just does whatever I tell them to do I don't have a kid that I can truly overpower and there's you know there's this. It's a transition. It's a transition for us. So we have to a little bit.
05:35.34
mvhuber
Yes.
05:44.40
mvhuber
Um.
05:44.68
Rachel Duffy
Go through that transition grieve so to speak the chapter that is closing has closed and lean into the chapter that is now opening for us with our children because the truth of the matter is even when one day they leave the nest. We're still going to be their parents.
05:54.20
mvhuber
A.
06:04.34
Rachel Duffy
We still want that connection with them. We still want to be relevant in their lives Even when they don't have to right? Even when we're not the ones who are providing a roof over their head and food on the table. We still want to be relevant in their lives. So it's it's ah it's.
06:06.55
mvhuber
A.
06:19.65
mvhuber
Yeah.
06:23.74
Rachel Duffy
There's a ah little bit of fear there that comes as you see your kids like oh what? if they don't need me anymore. What if they think I'm stupid. What do they think I'm an idiot I don't I'm just old and I don't understand their world and I don't know anything you know it brings up this.
06:24.20
mvhuber
Sure there is.
06:41.59
mvhuber
Sure Yeah, and I think I'll go back to what you said before about opportunity again I'll sort of frame it from my own perspective like I've started to see that window open where I go. It's not going to be very long now before they're gone.
06:42.27
Rachel Duffy
Fear of loss.
06:56.50
mvhuber
Right? And so I try to run my remind myself too that it's really important that I make my life a priority as much as I can because in five or six years they're gone but I'm still here. So like if I put everything on hold or I you know live everything that I do.
07:07.76
Rachel Duffy
Um, right.
07:14.24
mvhuber
Centers through them and I don't really make time for myself. That's going to be even harder right? like because I see in 14 year olds he's gone all the time he's with his friends like I want to go out dad I want to go do this. They don't want to sit home and hang out with me and that's okay, but like it's like it's it's like oh my god I'm not going to see these kids anymore and not what am I going to do you know I think that's hard.
07:15.19
Rachel Duffy
Yeah, yeah.
07:33.74
mvhuber
And as a parent a lot of people their identity so much of their identity is in being a parent that any Sort. It's sort of like be I'll tie to sports right? like I talk about this with athletes all the time so much of their identity as athlete right? that when things don't go their way. It. There's like this. Ultra Perfectionism and it's just everything that makes him feel like they're a failure if my kid isn't looking and doing and saying and and behaving the way that I want them to do so the world can see the reflection of me the parent is going to have a really hard time with that.
08:08.69
Rachel Duffy
Absolutely and I love that you brought up this topic of identity because one of the things I work on in my parent groups is we call it the identity switch because we really do have to examine. What is our identity and what have we tied.
08:26.41
mvhuber
And.
08:26.91
Rachel Duffy
Into that identity of Mom Dad parent. You know the person who's supposed to I'm supposed to raise these kids to live up to a certain checklist and even if we're not. You know there's no bad intentions behind it. We want the best.
08:36.80
mvhuber
Ah.
08:45.24
Rachel Duffy
For our children but at the same time we have to be super aware of that kind of undercurrent of expectation that we're putting on them that they then get to carry about who they are in the world are they being.
08:55.25
mvhuber
M.
09:03.76
Rachel Duffy
Good Kids are they disappointing us in some way and if so what does that mean for their connection with us. How are they going to express that. Do they have room to talk about it with us are these conversations even allowed in our home. How do we process these feelings together right? There's a ton.
09:12.23
mvhuber
Um, and.
09:19.75
mvhuber
Sure.
09:23.75
Rachel Duffy
That comes up around this and you're right? Who am I if I am not mother to my children if I am not father to my children if I'm not a mentor if I'm not central in their lives who am I What is my worth What do I bring to the table.
09:39.89
mvhuber
A.
09:42.46
Rachel Duffy
These are all the things that start coming up and I think these teenage years as you see the first glimmers of your kid not needing you as much.
09:53.90
mvhuber
Yeah, Absolutely you know? and and I think for a lot of people if we're not if our identity is not parent. It's as as an employee right? as ah as a as a professional so like talk can you talk about like that I'm curious about that like. You get parents who come to you. They need Help. You're helping them like how much of this sort of parental the challenges they have or the play it goes with work right? that sort of guilt of like working maybe traveling providing right? like how much of that sort of. Gets weaved into the the conversations you have.
10:30.34
Rachel Duffy
It's really I feel like it's It's inseparable because there's all the when we think about who we are as humans as adults parenting is a big part of it and.
10:32.16
mvhuber
Right.
10:43.80
Rachel Duffy
Work is another big part of it. It's a huge part of our identity and you know I feel like parenting or not I feel but I know parenting is a portal for us to know ourselves better. So is our work.
10:43.87
mvhuber
A.
11:03.49
Rachel Duffy
The way we carry ourselves in work the way we lead ourselves our employees the way we are led by our bosses if we have bosses these are all ways in which we have opportunities to really expand who we think we are.
11:13.59
mvhuber
Ah.
11:21.00
Rachel Duffy
Expand those narratives and stories that are in our heads about that. We've inherited right? be someone somewhere along the way probably told us who we were and what our place was in the world and we internalize that and now we carry this narrative around and.
11:27.65
mvhuber
And.
11:36.88
mvhuber
A.
11:39.65
Rachel Duffy
About ourselves like I'm a perfectionist I'm a high achiever I'm stubborn I'm relentless I'm fill in the blank that becomes your identity. It becomes what you think is your personality. But really what it is. It's just a narrative.
11:47.29
mvhuber
Yep I Love that.
11:58.41
Rachel Duffy
That you got somewhere along the way long long time ago that you've internalized so deeply that you think it's who you are and parenting challenges that and so does work work challenges that about you. So yes, these things are intertwined and.
12:03.83
mvhuber
Um, yeah.
12:17.69
Rachel Duffy
Um, again I look at it as a beautiful opportunity for us to look beyond those narratives can we expand those stories can we change them when it's necessary to change them. You know when we've grown them and it's time to move on.
12:33.30
mvhuber
Yeah, and we and and our work I think is very similar in that in our respective you know audiences or clients I do the same things right? like the the young people that I work with come with this narrative this story about themselves that. They don't think they either can change or they don't think they need to change and it really serves as a ah defense mechanism or protection like to to understand that story and have like this like definition of yourself is one way to just sort of simplify things and say this is what I am Then when you ask them to.
12:57.21
Rachel Duffy
Um, right? yeah.
13:01.19
Rachel Duffy
Yes.
13:12.24
mvhuber
Step away from that and like really challenge that and try to Change. It is really uncomfortable now for a kid. It's probably easier because it's just less just just less history right? There's less baggage. But when you're dealing with someone who's maybe 40 years old had their own parents their own teachers. Their own coaches right? All of that's been programmed into them and now all of a sudden you've got this situation where you want things to go exactly the same way because this is what you know and now all of a sudden. It's like it's not going the way I want it to that's that's really really hard and I think the word that comes to mind is control right.
13:47.28
Rachel Duffy
Um, yeah.
13:50.61
mvhuber
Like we all want to like there's like a but power dynamic there of like I'm the parent. You're the child this comes up and like what I say goes because I know better and if you don't do it then you know then you need to be punished. There's ah, there's ah you know some sort of um you know there's no reward, whatever right? like that's just like so common. So like how do you start to get people to look at those stories differently.
14:13.80
Rachel Duffy
Yeah, that's a really great question and so I think first of all kids versus adults is a little bit different because kids are not developmentally ready to challenge all of those stories. So I think with kids personally I cut them some slack and.
14:28.80
mvhuber
Yeah.
14:32.45
Rachel Duffy
Ah, we have to remember as adults that part of why they have these narratives is because they think that was how they adapted to their environment. This is how they guaranteed that they are getting through their childhoods they put together the pieces of.
14:49.90
mvhuber
A.
14:52.17
Rachel Duffy
How they need to be how they need to be in the world in order to guarantee our love and that's how they adapted to their environment growing up now I know that parents out there are listening and thinking. No. My children does my children don't need to be a certain way to guarantee my love I understand that but our kids don't our kids because of them being super young and our every single word every action carries so much weight.
15:26.33
mvhuber
Um.
15:27.29
Rachel Duffy
In their eyes and they're just not developmentally mature to really draw the correct conclusions. So to them. They have to grow up and perform in certain ways in order to guarantee their spot in the family. This is how these narratives form and it's normal. And at the same time.. It's not healthy, normal and healthy are not the same thing So challenge it and this is why I love that people like you are out there working with our kids to help our children challenge their own narratives and then when it comes to us as adults.
15:50.84
mvhuber
Yep.
16:03.90
Rachel Duffy
First of all, we have to become aware of those narratives and we have to become aware. We got them for the same reasons too. Yeah, we also connected to our own upbringings right? so.
16:08.81
mvhuber
Yeah, there's the go ahead I'm sorry now I said.
16:18.24
Rachel Duffy
Yes, there is I think now that we're in the quote unquote driver seat and every parent knows this you have leverage over your kids right? Even though I know that every parent knows just like our teens know which buttons to push on us the other way around is also true.
16:33.88
mvhuber
Are.
16:37.92
Rachel Duffy
We also know their buttons So every parent has that leverage The question is do you use it and why are you using it right? like become aware of what it is. You're trying to get out of this relationship. Do you want? just.
16:47.56
mvhuber
And.
16:57.64
Rachel Duffy
Like a transactional relationship I give you food and shelter and an allowance and you shut up and do what I say that's that's a type of relationship right? and it has It is real totally and it has consequences. It has real consequences.
17:09.48
mvhuber
Um, and that's real that exists it does long term for sure you know if not short term I agree with you like there's just an an immense amount to kind of sort of dig into there I Think the first thing that I I thought is you know.
17:16.96
Rachel Duffy
What? yes.
17:27.64
mvhuber
As us as ah as somebody who deals with sports families the dynamic around sports right? This idea that parents say and do a lot of things some of them. They they do out of emotion right? They react to things sometimes they don't even realize what they're saying the kids they internalize.
17:30.54
Rachel Duffy
Yeah, yeah.
17:47.24
mvhuber
Everything and so there's this what I would say is becomes a conditional relationship right? The kid perceives that if I don't perform well that I'm disappointing Mom or dad or I'm wasting Mom or Dad's money or I'm not worth it.
17:54.59
Rachel Duffy
Um, right? yeah right? Oh no, no, no no and in fact, more so they don't mean those things either. However, it is conditional. It is set up.
18:04.84
mvhuber
And the parents don't say those things but but.
18:13.43
mvhuber
It's happening.
18:14.60
Rachel Duffy
In that way where what kids are internalizing is if I'm good then my parents love me right? and and it looks different in every family but in one family It's if I'm great at baseball.
18:22.33
mvhuber
You got it.
18:31.80
Rachel Duffy
My dad spends time with me right? Well what will I do I mean every child really will bend themselves into a pretzel in order to have connection and attention from their parents. So if I have to be the best at baseball.
18:33.83
mvhuber
Um, yeah.
18:46.47
mvhuber
Ah.
18:49.75
Rachel Duffy
Because that is why my dad spends time on Saturday he he coaches the games he comes to the games. He's interested invested in the game. Okay, if that's what I have to do then? That's what I'm gonna do now like you said it's not that parents come at it from the intention of well I'm gonna. I'm gonna make it such that if my kid doesn't play baseball then I'm not gonna have anything to do with them of course not of course not but we have to become aware that this is how it gets internalized by our children. So what do we do to kind of counter that.
19:20.60
mvhuber
Um, yes, yeah, and what do we do.
19:26.64
Rachel Duffy
How do we provide an antidote to that. So I think it depends on I mean it this definitely looks different in every but I think there are some general rules. So number 1 is once we're aware.
19:34.53
mvhuber
That's a big question I know.
19:41.98
Rachel Duffy
That our children are constantly looking for our approval. Did I do good. Do you still love me even when I mess up in baseball. How about this? do you love me when I tell you that after 9 years of you investing thousands of dollars and driving me all over the country to go to but to games.
19:44.28
mvhuber
A.
20:01.32
Rachel Duffy
And you sacrificing all your weekends I tell you I Actually don't like baseball I don't like it I want to quit Do you still love me Now. So becoming aware of these situations helps us as parents to be more. I Think be more intentional and mindful with the ways in which we connect with our children with the messages that we send them knowing they're probably gonna twist these messages in some Way. So How do I make sure I am telling them.
20:32.17
mvhuber
Are.
20:39.27
Rachel Duffy
In a million different ways that they matter that I don't need them to be a certain way in order for me to love them that there is nothing they can do to add or take away from their worth. There's nothing they can do I don't care if you're an a student.
20:54.57
mvhuber
Ah.
20:58.50
Rachel Duffy
Or if you got into division 1 something in college that doesn't add to how much you matter in this family so that that is the shift I would say is getting us to understand how to communicate.
21:15.30
mvhuber
Um, yeah, yeah, community to me. The 1 thing that I was thinking that always I feel like is sort of the the bridge right? The sort of the magic wand is communication right? because listen at a certain level. You can say.
21:15.98
Rachel Duffy
That message.
21:33.27
mvhuber
Anything and everything all the time it still doesn't guarantee that the person on the other end, especially a young person is going to interpret it in a way that makes them comfortable right? But at least if you are coming for a place from a place of good intention and you're really trying.
21:43.21
Rachel Duffy
Right? Right. Yes.
21:52.67
mvhuber
To communicate those things in a healthy way on a regular basis then you can like put your head on the pillow at night and say hey like I've really made every effort as a parent to change and make sure that my child feels cared for because at a certain point the truth of the matter is we're not the only one socializing them.
22:09.96
Rachel Duffy
Right? right.
22:12.50
mvhuber
Right? Like they got to go onto the world. They spend more time at school with their friends than they do with us at a certain point right? So they could come home into my house for 2 hours in a night we can talk and all those great things and then they're out with their friends for you know, 12 hours in a day and that has and that was certainly the case in my in my life. My family was.
22:23.26
Rachel Duffy
Um, yes.
22:29.80
mvhuber
My friends had a greater influence over me at a certain point than my family did.
22:32.47
Rachel Duffy
That's right and the fact that you know as children mature and certainly get into the teenagers they start orienting towards their friends more than they orient towards their parents. How many times have I had my clients come to me with teenagers telling me my children told me I'm.
22:39.00
mvhuber
A.
22:50.40
Rachel Duffy
Irrelevant They treat me like I'm invisible like I don't matter like I'm an idiot and I have to say like you know it. It makes me cringe a little because I remember doing that to my parents too. So while it is normal.
23:00.64
mvhuber
And.
23:06.43
Rachel Duffy
Um, in the sense that it is widespread right? if your kid is orienting towards their peers more than they are towards you certainly in the teen years. It's normal in the sense that yeah, it's it's everywhere and you need to work to turn it around. As much as you can maintain that connection with your child. It doesn't matter how old your kids are right now. So even if you have children who are 18 right now and you're listening to this and thinking. Oh it's way too late. It is not too late. It is never too late work on creating the. Type of connection with your child that they will want to orient towards you even in the teenage years even when they're grown-ups I just had this come up yesterday in my family I don't have teens yet I have pre-teens. And we did um every year we do this like holiday photo and it goes on our Christmas card and for the last two years we didn't do it for obvious reasons. So this was our first year getting back to it post covid and um, you know.
24:13.40
mvhuber
And.
24:20.13
Rachel Duffy
All the people who are on my kind of holiday Christmas list are always telling me your family pictures are so amazing I wait for your card every year so like there's an expectation built in this year
24:30.40
mvhuber
The.
24:35.30
Rachel Duffy
Because my kids are you know they're not super little anymore I told them they could wear whatever they wanted I honestly like I was also I was just like it was too much for me to start coordinating. Everyone's outfits I was like whatever just wear whatever you want to wear so yesterday we you know it's. The morning of photos I kind of remind them today. We have photos later. They're like okay, yeah, yeah, great. Great an hour before I I kind of prompt them. You know you might want to start getting dressed all 3 of them come out wearing stained sweatpants. Basically sweatpants sweatshirts crazy colors. One of my kids comes out with a hat and I had to take a deep breath and say to myself. Okay, first of all I told them they could wear whatever they wanted so I need to mean that and if I didn't mean that I should not have said it. So I have to like breathe through that then my daughter comes to me so for help so she wanted me to help her like brush her hair or whatever we start brushing her hair and it's super tangly because she probably hasn't washed it in like four days
25:33.85
mvhuber
Ah.
25:50.27
Rachel Duffy
And it she flips a switch right? Every parent out there knows that moment where your child out of the blue has ah like a volcano that you didn't see coming and she melts down melts down so hard that she says I'm not coming.
26:02.60
mvhuber
Ah.
26:08.52
Rachel Duffy
I'm not coming to the photos now in my mind I'm already like talking myself off the ledge of like it's okay if she's not coming. She's not coming I mean what am I gonna do I'm gonna drag her there right? like with her puffy eyes and all mad.
26:24.14
mvhuber
Um, right.
26:27.32
Rachel Duffy
And the whole thing we arranged also after the photos we arranged. We made a reservation at her favorite restaurant because she's a bit of a peaky eater so she was like I'm not going to the restaurant I'm not going to the photos I'm done and she slams the door and I think to myself. Okay, Rachel now what where where's my parenting coach right now right? like okay I gotta walk my talk so I go in there and I help her calm down from crying and I tell her listen. It's okay, if you don't want to come. You don't have to come.
26:50.40
mvhuber
Yeah, right.
27:05.69
Rachel Duffy
But then she starts crying that she doesn't want to stay home alone. So I'm like okay so you have to come with us. You don't have to take pictures but you have to you I can't do both things. So finally, she agrees to come along. But she's going to stay in the car the entire way. It's like a 10 minute drive to where we're going the entire way. She's telling us that she's not not going to take pictures. She's not going to the restaurant after the pit photos are done I'm going to drive her home and the rest of them are going to go to a restaurant and I'm going to stay home with her on and on and on and on. And in my mind I'm thinking I already paid so much money for but this picture and I'm not even going to send it out right? because I'm not going to send out a holiday picture without my kid. 1 of my kids so I'm just like in my mind I'm just like you know trying to so.
27:56.19
mvhuber
A.
27:56.85
Rachel Duffy
Stay present. We park the car I get the other kids out and I tell her listen me I'm gonna crack the windows open a little bit and she looks at me and she says 3 photos I'm gonna take 3 photos. So.
28:05.74
mvhuber
Right.
28:12.34
mvhuber
Okay.
28:15.31
Rachel Duffy
Okay, she ended up doing all the Photos. We went to the restaurant she was in the best mood I said to her dude What was that about and she's like well I my mood changed So I changed my mind and I was like okay. So What did you learn to myself I said what? what did I learn I learned that I have to let her go through her process Even if it means that at the end of it like I was not guaranteed any results at the end. Oh It was painful.
28:47.25
mvhuber
Um, right sure right? ah.
28:53.75
Rachel Duffy
But it was a moment you know it was a moment where without saying it She said to me. Thank you for letting me go through the process and just allowing me to have my moment.
29:03.83
mvhuber
Um, yeah, that's awesome because I one it's awesome because I got a kick out of the story because ah, we've all been through it too. It's awesome because it's It's exactly parallel parallel.
29:14.84
Rachel Duffy
Enough. Yes.
29:21.31
mvhuber
To what I see in sport which is coaches right? Who have to let their athletes solve their own problems right? You can give them guidance suggestions support but you can't solve the problem for them.
29:27.43
Rachel Duffy
Yeah.
29:36.17
Rachel Duffy
Yep, yeah.
29:38.93
mvhuber
Right? And if you try to solve your child's problem for him or her you know by giving the solutions or by waffling on something you decided you're not doing. You're not doing anybody any favors. You're not doing the kid a favor because they don't know how to solve the problem right? They don't know how to deal with adversity.
29:41.64
Rachel Duffy
Right.
29:47.82
Rachel Duffy
Right.
29:53.92
Rachel Duffy
Right? They built the scale right.
29:58.46
mvhuber
Deal with their feelings and as a parent you're not doing yourself any favors because then you're contradicting yourself and creating. Ah you know a bigger problem down the line by not being able to resolve it and and I think the fact that you just sort of were able to deal with it in the moment you said staying present. Something I talk about all the time is you got to be able to breathe right? that keeps us connected to the present and then find some way to make sense of the situation. So You don't lose your cool right.
30:19.55
Rachel Duffy
Alright. Right? And it was so this ties back into your question about identity because I have an identity of a really good problem solver and a fixer so had I still hung onto that identity I would have tried to fix this somehow. Would have tried to either fix her feelings or fix the fact that my photos were gonna get ruined right? So I I would have tried to problem solve instead of being in the problem. There's a problem right now she's got these big feelings. She doesn't know how to work through. I have this idea of a photo shoot that's supposed to go a certain way of my family that's supposed to look a certain way for me to send out these cards at Christmas and I have to be present to that without solving it just be in the problem and let her be in the problem. And you know what she did figure it out for herself. She figured out that a I can have different moods and that's okay and I can change my mind when my mood changes and that's also okay so yeah, it required me to move from.
31:41.57
Rachel Duffy
A fixer for that to be my identity to an identity of someone who has trust I have trust I trust her. She's gonna figure it out. Maybe not today. But at some point if I keep letting her practice. She will figure it out.
31:59.23
mvhuber
Absolutely Ah as a parent I'm a big believer in that I'm a big believer in giving my kids a space to take responsibility for what's going on in their lives and listen it's going to. It's going to correct at some point unless it's a very very extreme thing.
32:07.54
Rachel Duffy
Yeah.
32:13.46
Rachel Duffy
Right? But yeah now.
32:15.47
mvhuber
There are going to be consequences that they face whether it's academically or what have you and I always say them and said listen if your grades aren't good. Why aren't they good well are you trying your hardest well well okay so don't be surprised when you get a b plus back and not an a right? or. How did you play or did you play or how was it well, it was okay, well did you practice hard this week well no right like so like you make choices and and you got to know that it's okay to make whatever choices you want because the consequences don't really if if I'm being honest, they don't affect me right? like.
32:40.50
Rachel Duffy
Right? yeah.
32:49.71
Rachel Duffy
Right? right? but.
32:52.69
mvhuber
And we started talking about college believe it or not with my 14 year old this kind of starts coming up now right? Wow right? And he's a little young but it's not that far off and I'll tell us I'll tell this is a funny story right? like and maybe you could comment it just from your point of view. So so we're at ah, we're at ah, a soccer game and. My son has a soccer game in the morning and then we have she has to go to another game. Ah with my daughter in Princeton New Jersey which is where Princeton University is so she tells me she's this well you know after the game I'm going to see if Patrick wants to come to Lucy's game because then maybe we'll go to the campus to go to Princeton and. And you know he'll see how nice it is and they'll sort of motivate him and inspire him and she's like hey Pat hey Bud you want to go to Lucy's game in Princeton he's like no I don't want to go to prince and he's like what do you think you? you go to take me to campus and you're like and make me want to go there like he he sniffed it out from a mile away and it was like listen. If. You don't want to go to Princeton that's cool if you decide you want to go to Princeton 2 years You're screwed like so it's up to you not me and if you go to Princeton or you go to community college ah I personally don't care like whatever your journey is your journey and I'm there to support you. But I don't think that that's necessarily like the default setting in any parent right? I think there's this hyper hyper type a you know we got to do more go go go more activities more instruction more people like me more people like you.
34:20.83
mvhuber
So we can get to the the greatest colleges and make a lot of money and live this great life and meanwhile there's all the feelings inside that go with it that are really confusing and can make you really miserable just by virtue of having all that expectation put on your onto your head.
34:33.21
Rachel Duffy
Holy listen I have my friends who have fourteen year olds and even younger are talking about so we live on the west coast just outside San Francisco and my friends are talking about sending their kids to a boarding to boarding schools on the East Coast because
34:45.45
mvhuber
Um.
34:53.34
Rachel Duffy
They're the best education right? like the best boarding schools in our country are not in not in Northern California and I'm thinking to myself like that I can see that hamster wheel right? My friends are on this hamster wheel of being a type a.
34:58.40
mvhuber
Ah.
35:11.21
Rachel Duffy
High performers high achievers and now dumping that on their kids because that is yet another achievement for the parents. My kid got into Harvard my kid got into Yale my kid is growing up.
35:19.30
mvhuber
Um, that's right.
35:25.69
Rachel Duffy
With all these other kids who are all feeding into elite boarding schools who will then feed into elite colleges and is that really the is that really the best way for your kid I don't know. Maybe it is maybe it isn't but. Can we even have the conversation about it versus parents determining in Advance. No, you got to you have to do these things you have to check these checkboxes off otherwise otherwise what you know.
35:54.31
mvhuber
Yeah, yeah I Well I'm a failure as a parent otherwise you know I'm saying but but but I think that that's the feeling and and I think it goes back to something you said really early on in the conversation which is really trying to understand your child as a person.
36:01.49
Rachel Duffy
Exactly.
36:10.54
Rachel Duffy
Um, yeah.
36:14.30
mvhuber
Right? What makes them tick What makes them happy. What do you want to do with your life. What right? like we don't always know better T Dar I'm saying and if my philosophy is is if I create a supportive environment in the home.
36:20.26
Rachel Duffy
Um, right? Ah yeah.
36:28.42
Rachel Duffy
Yeah.
36:30.81
mvhuber
And I support my children and I communicate with them and I tell them how I feel and I tell them I love them and I'm there for them and they feel safe. They're going to make some pretty good choices I might not always agree with every choice but chances are they're just by nature not going to want to disappoint me, they know the difference and they're gonna do.
36:33.65
Rachel Duffy
Like.
36:50.14
mvhuber
Mostly the right thing are they going to test some of the boundary sure are they going to take risks. Are they going to say I want to go to school and you know I want to major in ceramics and I want to move to a commune in Vermont they might but if that makes them happy. Why not? why? not? Why is it.
37:03.34
Rachel Duffy
Right? right? and I remember when I was growing up I remember having this thought to myself that my parents don't know me better than I know myself sure they know me they know me very well.
37:06.26
mvhuber
Why does it have to be a certain way.
37:20.29
mvhuber
And.
37:22.20
Rachel Duffy
And they'd see things that I didn't see because I was young and immature and I lacked experience in life. So for sure. But that's why this needs to be a collaboration right? It's not I'm the know I'll be all as the parent and I'll tell you how I'll tell you the moves to make. So that you win this chess game. It's not a chess game. You don't need to Win. You need to be. You need to know who you are and you need to be okay and comfortable in your own skin. So can I help you and ask you some really good questions.
37:48.88
mvhuber
A.
37:58.57
Rachel Duffy
That will get you thinking about things in a different way. Yeah I can and I will but ultimately I have to as a parent I have to be okay with whatever choices my kid makes within the confines of the law right? like assuming.
38:15.41
mvhuber
Um, yeah, yeah.
38:16.49
Rachel Duffy
Not raising psychokillers. We have to be okay with their choices because the truth of the matter is they are not our do over. They are not the opportunity for us to fulfill all the potential that we didn't fulfill in our lives.
38:30.16
mvhuber
Um, yeah, well well, you've just I mean you've just hit the nail on the head as it relates to sports I think that that is the number 1 issue is parents who are trying to live.
38:32.76
Rachel Duffy
Because we didn't have the opportunity.
38:47.11
mvhuber
Vicariously through their children because of some lack of success or maybe it was a major success in athletics in ah, an athletic career and your child is a reflection of that or.
38:54.23
Rachel Duffy
Right.
39:02.20
mvhuber
Hey I know what it felt like when I didn't get to go play a sport in college and I really regret that So I don't want you to regret that like I want to push you to achieve at that level. But I never did and let me just trust me when I tell you it's really important and the kids look at the parents like.
39:10.97
Rachel Duffy
Um, right exactly right.
39:19.40
mvhuber
Like you know some of them do buy into it right? and and it creates a really really unhealthy dynamic but can I mean if the kids motivated and the motivations are aligned. It can work but there's just so much dumped onto the kids that frankly, it's the main reason why I exist in the world is to be able to sort of.
39:29.59
Rachel Duffy
Right.
39:37.66
mvhuber
Bridge the gap between parent and child because I think there is a misunderstanding about how to you know how to address these situations because like you said it's like you know you're you're you're you're projecting onto them.
39:47.76
Rachel Duffy
Right? And that's a thing and it comes from a really um, oftentimes it comes from a good place of I did not have opportunity because I grew up one way. Meanwhile I created all this opportunity and I want to give it to you So don't squander it.
40:03.10
mvhuber
And.
40:05.19
Rachel Duffy
Because I didn't have this opportunity I don't know if you you were told this as a kid I I did not like my mom's cooking and I wouldn't eat and oftentimes my parents would tell me that they're starving kids in Africa now that is true that they're starving kids in Africa and you know. It's true that I had you know a better upbringing than those starving kids in Africa and it's also true that that was irrelevant to me in that moment right? that my parents were not seeing me. They were.
40:37.28
mvhuber
Yeah.
40:40.80
Rachel Duffy
The opportunities that they were giving me that I was quote unquote squandering away that I had good healthy, fresh homemade food on the table meanwhile all these other kids you know are eating whatever they're eating.
40:52.37
mvhuber
Are.
40:57.14
Rachel Duffy
Boxed Mac Mac and cheese and I'm laughing because I have but I make my kids boxed Mac and cheese too. That's right and there's no shame in it. But you know what I'm saying it's like it was another thing that got that it's just a little way in which we dump on our children.
40:59.63
mvhuber
Me too because it works.
41:16.00
Rachel Duffy
And we expect them. You should be grateful right? Why aren't you grateful look at all this abundance that you have meanwhile there's you know children in Ukraine who are living in in war right.
41:28.51
mvhuber
Yeah, well the word there that I always highlight is one of my least favorite words in the English languages should ah you should be grateful. You should do this. You should do that.
41:32.18
Rachel Duffy
Um, yeah.
41:37.86
Rachel Duffy
Um, right.
41:40.89
mvhuber
Like I should do this like I should have like you know like why? Why should you have right? because like there was an expectation created you know created of you or or put on to you I Hate that word, you know and I use it too for myself I should have done this but like some people are just so. Hypercritical of themselves as a parent like I you secondguesed yourself or they put it onto their kids and they make them feel guilty like oh that you didn't eat to me in that situation if my kid doesn't eat my cooking like Good. Don't eat either either go go figure it out yourself or get hungry and eat what I need like you know what? I'm saying like.
41:59.31
Rachel Duffy
Hairline.
42:07.59
Rachel Duffy
Yeah, my right right.
42:16.91
mvhuber
There's also a solution right? like I don't have to force the issue. So I just I think listen when we have all these stresses to be fair to parents hear me when you have stress in your life when you've got bills to pay. You've got kids to get different places. You got a job. Maybe you have a business you know, maybe a.
42:25.74
Rachel Duffy
Yeah, yeah.
42:33.17
mvhuber
Got other family stuff going on I just went through some family stuff distress really piles up and it's really hard to sort of compartmentalize that right it all sort of runs together right? and so can I mean can you talk about that like how how might you. Help a parent and I do want to have you ah give you a chance to talk about how you coach parents like talk about the process but like how can you? How do you help parents make sense of the idea that sometimes that discomfort or dissatisfaction or the feelings they have in ah, a situation with a kid.
43:09.61
Rachel Duffy
Yeah, yeah, and so first of all I think we all need to be way more compassionate towards ourselves first before we even get talking about our kids and having compassion for them. It starts with us.
43:09.64
mvhuber
Aren't actually tied to the kid. They're more tied to the other stuff that's going on.
43:21.16
mvhuber
Um, right.
43:29.70
Rachel Duffy
Because the truth is the people we judge the most is ourselves and the people we're harsh on is ourselves and this is why we have mom or dad guilt because we're so harsh on ourselves. We're so afraid of disappointing our children our own parents. Our.
43:34.10
mvhuber
A.
43:48.26
Rachel Duffy
Spouse Whoever it is and really we don't even pay any attention to what it is that we need for ourselves. Can we not disappoint ourselves that it goes back to your point on I got to do stuff for myself because before I know it My kids are going to be out the door and then who am I. So It's about this internal process of really raising ourselves if you will and then we can expand that into how do I now that I've developed connection compassion towards myself now. How do I. Work on that with my kids as well and so the the parents who come to me for the most part if I could I mean you know success looks different in every family right? because our families are different. But if I could you know, kind of put it in a nutshell I would say parents just want things to be a little easier.
44:26.30
mvhuber
Sure.
44:44.50
Rachel Duffy
They want connection. They want to know that they're doing a good job raising emotionally healthy kids right? like that's all we want so that one day when they do fly out the nest a they don't fly that far that they never want to see us again. And b they have the skills they need to be. You know, successful adults in the world. So that's really what all parents want but things get in the way of that things like I don't have support. Either I don't have a supportive spouse or I don't have a spouse at all or I'm juggling twenty jobs and I have you know all the stress and anxiety we have stuff so we have circumstances that genuinely make things hard for us. So that's 1 thing that gets in the way another thing that gets in the way is our kids don't listen to us. Unless we yell or threaten or do something right? So how do I learn how to communicate with them in a way that they do listen and I don't have to be yelling all day and I don't have to be compromising boundaries because boundaries are necessary and then there's also the parents who come to me and say listen I'm trying to.
45:45.28
mvhuber
Are.
45:49.87
Rachel Duffy
And do the work like I'm really I'm on board I'm committed I'm doing the work but it isn't working and that for the most part is about us becoming aware of the things you and I talked about dumping onto our children the expectations that we inherited from our environment. How do we dump those on our kids. Unintentionally so it's becoming aware of that and breaking those cycles. So when you take all these things together that is the work that that I do that I find myself doing with the parents to me. Um, and you know some of them come to me with.
46:14.50
mvhuber
Um, yeah.
46:27.88
Rachel Duffy
Very young kids some of them come to me with teens and some of them come to me when their children are adults so you know this work can be done at any phase of your life.
46:37.53
mvhuber
Do you find that those people who come to you is it usually in a sense of urgency to fix a problem or is it something that's been more proactive.
46:48.70
Rachel Duffy
I Think what there's a couple things one is there is a sense of urgency the parents who are experiencing their children not listening those parents have fire under their butt because something's got to give they're exhausted. They're overwhelmed. They got no gas in the tank. They have. They know something's got to change because this is unsustainable and then there are parents who come with this just gnawing feeling in the pit of their stomach that I am not doing a good job here. Something is not working and I don't know what it is and I need help So it's.
47:10.46
mvhuber
Um.
47:27.60
Rachel Duffy
Urgent but from a different place from a place of I am seeing the bigger picture here and I need to change the trajectory of this ship.
47:37.91
mvhuber
Okay, and and so I guess you know the motivation to come to somebody like you First of all I think you know and I've been through coaching and therapy and all these different things that require. Ah you know? ah so a solid dose of humility.
47:52.92
Rachel Duffy
Um, yeah.
47:55.84
mvhuber
Right? As a parent to like drop your guard and say like listen like I need someone to help me right? because that's an admission of like maybe I'm not as good as of a parent or as a person as I thought I was but.
47:58.80
Rachel Duffy
Um, right.
48:06.67
Rachel Duffy
Um, yeah.
48:10.82
mvhuber
Making that decision to come to you as 1 but then they get into the process of coaching which I would assume you could tell me more requires them to be actively involved and do things and challenge themselves and take risks. Emotionally. So what's that like I mean is there resistance. Do you see parents who get into it and get uncomfortable or like what just talk me through that.
48:32.12
Rachel Duffy
Yeah, that's a great question. You know I think this So first of all, you don't have to have reached rock bottom before you ask for help like why do we do that like sure you can you can I have I help people who are at Rock bottom. But why.
48:44.87
mvhuber
Um, and.
48:51.12
Rachel Duffy
Why would you do that to yourself right? Don't don't wait for rock about them. What I ask parents to do because I know how busy we all are all I ask is that you come 1 hour a week if you can commit to 1 hour a week we can change your family and.
48:53.65
mvhuber
Are ah.
49:08.81
Rachel Duffy
Yes, of course you have to practice in the middle of the week and you know when you're not being coached on a call but really the way I teach people how to change.
49:13.29
mvhuber
Yeah, yeah.
49:20.65
Rachel Duffy
Is incorporated into their everyday experiences. In other words, there isn't anything you need to do beyond what you're already doing you just have to do it differently. So yeah, it takes some practice I just had this mom who's been in my group for a while and when she came in she has. Ah, she had a kid who she has 2 kids but her younger one was they were spanking him all the time because he was defiant unpredictable explosive these are words they used to describe this kid and when I told her. How about we try correcting his behavior without punishing him. She thought I was I literally lost my marbles she was like are you nuts like what do you mean? There's consequences when you call when you when you're rude to your parent or when you don't listen, there's consequences and I said well let's just try this and we worked together. And I got to give her credit that she came and did the work even when she had doubt slowly but surely over time things started to change between her and her son and fast forward to now. She leaves me messages yesterday. She left me a message. She said listen we were at church and it's not like he was sitting the whole time at church paying attention and listening but I caught him trying I caught him trying to.
50:46.53
Rachel Duffy
Pay Attention I caught him trying to pray I caught him trying to do his best and I appreciated that and I never was able to even see that he was trying before you and I started working together. So for me I was like I'm done. That's it This is this. The only the reason for my existence that that kid who will never know me by the way right? like I I don't even know what he looks like if he walked by me on the street I wouldn't recognize him but that kid now has a chance to grow up with a mom who can see him.
51:05.46
mvhuber
Yes.
51:22.97
Rachel Duffy
And connect with him and appreciate him and doesn't have to spank him because she lost her own temper so you know to me like that that is the deeper purpose and the deeper reason for why I do this work So when you come into my groups.
51:28.96
mvhuber
Um, yep, that's awesome.
51:40.44
Rachel Duffy
Does it get uncomfortable Sometimes yeah, it does but let me tell you this. It's already uncomfortable. How uncomfortable is it right now and how much discomfort can you ultimately let go of that is really how you have to look at it is not how much dis.
51:46.10
mvhuber
That's a good point right.
51:52.81
mvhuber
Right.
51:58.00
Rachel Duffy
Um, for do I have to face or how much do you get to stop facing.
52:01.30
mvhuber
Well, it sounds like that's exactly what happened with your client too. She was able to like put things into perspective right? like sometimes we just get so wrapped up in our own Stuff. You can't just like you describing that scene of her like seeing him like not just. Seeing him for who he is and allowing him to be who he is and appreciating that rather than always and and this is something that I'm really big on as a coach and as a parent seeing the good seeing the positive seeing the strengths and and coaching and parenting from a place of strength rather than.
52:29.49
Rachel Duffy
Um, yeah.
52:37.79
Rachel Duffy
Pretty yeah.
52:38.34
mvhuber
Always like assuming that what's been done. That's good. Doesn't need to be spoken about because that's what you're supposed to do you should do and every little knit in every little flaw and every little mistake you make is pointed out and harped on like nobody.
52:43.69
Rachel Duffy
Right? right.
52:53.80
Rachel Duffy
Right? right.
52:56.50
mvhuber
Me you 47 77 seven years old nobody wants to be treated that way and we do it all the time.
53:03.73
Rachel Duffy
Right? And it happened to her because she started opening up compassion towards herself. She started seeing herself and that is what enabled her to to.
53:17.35
mvhuber
Um I love that I love that so as we as we wind down here. Um I this tends to be a hard question I guess I I ask 1 last question of everybody. It's usually this. It's it's the same maybe with a little bit of different variation depending on. The world you you operate in as a professional or person but the question I ask is if you had to leave just one piece of advice to parents listening like what would that piece of advice. Be.
53:48.73
Rachel Duffy
I think the 1 thing for you to remember as a parent is to put things to look at the bigger picture I think that is the best piece of advice I would give parents in general look at the bigger picture. Sometimes we get caught up in the moment and things seem really important or we have this like death grip on a specific outcome and 99.9 of the time it isn't like that so zoom out for a moment. Take a breath. And take a look at the bigger picture and the bigger context of what it is. You're up against in this moment with your child because I promise you most of the time there's more to it than what you think in that moment so that would be my one advice.
54:42.82
mvhuber
Um, okay, yeah, and I totally agree with that right? I think sometimes we make them out to be. You know we tell ourselves stories about how big of a deal this is when it's really like nobody really cares. We think people are looking at us and we're like oh we're worried about what Mrs Jones and Mrs Smith are going to say and then like. They're worried about their own kid and their own problems and like they don't care what we do right? So like really just sort of like trying to keep it into perspective like it's going to be okay and so with that Rachel I I want to thank you for um, being a guest on the show I love talking to you.
55:09.17
Rachel Duffy
Um, right.
55:17.67
mvhuber
Thank you for having me on your podcast I'm looking forward to that and I love to keep talking I think we sort of sing from the same book songbook.
55:25.83
Rachel Duffy
Yeah, Absolutely I Can't wait for um I Can't wait for this episode to release and the episode on my podcast to release and I I really am so grateful that our paths crossed because I agree with you I think we're both doing. Really similar work in the world Ultimately in different you know it looks different on the outside but really deep down.. It's very similar. Thank you.
55:43.41
mvhuber
Now.
55:50.77
mvhuber
Um, agreed Thank you so much again.